Think I agree on that.  Jungler required unless you are gigantic or have figured out a few champs that can solo him.  

I guess another thing - has everyone here killed rift herald at various times?  It helps to have a very realistic understand of the DPS output at various times.  I've done it with renek and a jungler as early as 6 or 7 minutes in.  At that point, yeah, it sure can be risky.  You both can get quite low and imo its very risky unless you are fully aware of folks locations.  Typically at that point, you are, though (you'd only call for it if your jungler is nearby and you just wiped the top laner, you see mid in lane, etc).  Folks aren't currently keyed in to even consider the enemy is taking rift at 6 or 7 minutes.  Anyway, super high risk there imo.

BUT - its a very different story 10 minutes in as you and your jungler will have a few items - and both tanky or DPS items are extremely useful here.  More dps to kill him fast - more tankiness and you are soaking and still procing the eye for 15% max health damage.  It actually feels very safe to me at that point with renekton anyway and if you can trade off tanking, good.  I really think folks should try it out around the 10 minute mark to get the feel for it though.  

Anyway, so, you lose dragon pressure - so its kind of smeh for that.  You gain map pressure while should be drawing the enemy jungler top to try to slow or stop your push - which helps the other side of the map.  

Nope - I did consider the korean caster yelling about penta kill.  What I picked is better and much more stupid

Exactly.  The problem is that it does a TON of damage, so if you get caught on it, lots of people are dying.  Last night, there were constant calls to do it when their mid and top were BOTH alive (although pushed) and we didn't know where their jungler was either (although we suspected bot).  Now, we might think that it wasn't warded from a statistical perspective, but if we are wrong (or if they saw us going to it from a lane ward), they get multiple kills AND the buff.  Which is probably a game losing play.  If we are right, well, we basically don't get a whole lot.

The problem was that although the buff is pretty good on Renekton, Sion is actually really good at defending against it.  So we weren't getting towers when we got it.  And if you don't get towers when you get the buff, its really a net loss.

You can't justify the buff with "it gives you gold!" because you can get more gold from just farming and not wasting time on it.  And somebody is always going to have to go back after the buff unless they are Nunu or something from tanking it, wasting a lot of time.  So no towers down from the buff is a net loss on the team.  We lost A LOT from taking the first RH buff.  I lost gold/xp, and they got a free (trademark) dragon when they heard it go down, but we didn't get a tower from the buff.

It's just not a good objective in most games right now, which is why it isn't emphasized in competitive play that I've seen, and is definitely not emphasized in high ELO play.

dont mess with my trademarks.

With the Sion example - yah, he was able to stop slow my push pretty easily as full tank.  

Let's talk what would proper utilization be then. So, I think its primarily useful for 1 thing - killing turrets (or at least heavy push power followed by roaming).  Its strategic volume goes WAY up if the top laner has TP.  This would enable a quick recall + TP anywhere if there is a good opportunity for a push at any location including to a creep that is currently tanking a turret.  

It's secondary usage would be roaming and pushing then.  Faster movement speed and that faster recall gets you somewhere else quick.  

3rd usage, and the weakest imo, is in using that added damage for a kill in top lane.  10% dmg buff is very nice, ofc - super nice.  BUT - combined with the minions auto pushing now, you can't control the wave.  Which means you get 1 rotation, then the wave pushes.  You can bounce it back, but you are in an auto push for about 1 min 45 sec.  On renekton, that REALLY lowers his kill potential unless you've already stomped the crap out of the top laner.  

I think its a buff that would be best used in tandem.  But that also can prove a little difficult as either the top laner or the jungler will probably need to recall.  

Maybe you could do it so the top laner tanks it big time leaving the jungler healthy.  Give the buff to the jungler, but the jungler then needs to insta gank a lane, help push a lane, or tower dive with one other person.... probably mid.  

We could also have the jungler tank, take the buff, base, then go wherever the jungler wants to go (maybe pick up 1 camp max), then gank a lane.

The timing rules you mention when its "safe" to take the buff potentially add to the problem.  If the enemy top laner must be dead to take it, then they will be back whenever you are with a full health bar - and that leads to either I have to be able to quickly bully and kill or nearly kill them followed by a push, or something.

So, thoughts on optimal utilization? 

so instead of the armor comment for enemy triple kill, how about 1 of these?

https://app.box.com/s/qb5vwdtog5qiecnmicna9bn7bpj3vkn0

and this is the one that actually tilted me from version 1

https://app.box.com/s/7m74cp3eqkncktzc2gnb1n7eai33nevh

Probably waiting until The Rift Herald's base damage and starting level are weakened next patch before focusing on it too hard as an objective?

One thing that you should consider is that SoloRenektonOnly is a current Diamond I player and former Master Tier player and he isn't all that active on his main account right now.  So you might have been watching him play on a smurf account in low Diamond or possibly even high Plat.  In games where you have a Master Tier Top Lane Specialist One Trick Pony Smurf on your team, Rift Herald might be a viable objective more often than when we have you as our Top.  No offense.

The best use for it is pushing down a tower. Hopefully you get top and perhaps rotate mid to demolish it but this can quickly be derailed by a team rallying around there mid laner. I think its just a way to quickly move your snowbally top laner out of top lane and to get him moving around the map sooner to make plays with his early game advantage. 

"WHERE THE HELL IS THE TEAM" has my vote. 

there are some gems in these videos as well:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5z2DCsRsXw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2qYt66-5Dg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EC9UcFzoRxE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zFLDyZ4V3nk => approximently 17:30, 27:06

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yo2jggiqv7s => 4:38

I think the problem though is the rotation/setup.  If I'm top lane and I get this, I'm probably basing unless we force the jungler to tank and knock him out of play.  You can't maximize the use imo with an enemy in the lane, or at least you can't lock down much dmg due to the constant push.  You just end up getting a little more ahead.  I think alternative strategy is needed.

ok I isolated a bunch from that - see for the audio clips.  Not sure about placement

https://app.box.com/s/l0clhsyl3kz0wivu5mfxqftpav0hezqe

And here's 1.4

v1.4 - includes the changes we discussed

https://app.box.com/s/jqj9i36xlnq87h5bu2rkg6gqwnnmfz9l

OK - so here's a point where you can have some more direct feedback if you like and actually change up the files I'll be using.  

I'll start with this.  This is a google sheet of the spreadsheet that shows the files I'm using.  It tells you the message that is played (ex 52 - first blood) and then the corresponding wav file.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1uMXveC1MW3EniUXRPLoj31-mYycbrcPXTLf1NLD4_Wo/edit?usp=sharing

If that link doesn't work, I've also uploaded the excel file:  https://app.box.com/s/w08pn1cpzkpr2tlpt9ntwkexmkzhhg2v

OK. So...

tonight I ripped some additional audio but have not loaded it into the pack.  I added that to the source WAV files (note, the names of the files correspond DIRECTLY with what is listed in the google sheet/excel.  Then I uploaded all of those files.  ALL of the new files start with the word NEW.  So, download the WAVs and listen to the new ones.  Then look at the sheet and decide if you think any of those new files fit anywhere else.  I also included the unedited audio where karl and I are having a little fight and I drive him crazy.  That will likely get cut up a bit.

Anyway, here's a link to the audio clips.

https://app.box.com/s/m68759g0ugyj1x9qcpdl3lqy64v7etbx

An easy way to start is to just download the audio clips and quickly listen through the new ones.  If you hear something you think would be good to add, make a note of that and just mention it here.  If you want to take the next step, look at the spreadsheet and suggest a specific place for it (ex replace first blood message with No No.wav)

I won't be on until approximently Sunday night due to the holidays and traveling. I will try to take a look at the excel file and give you some recommendations for replacement/divesifying. I did get Peter to install the mod when it was version 1.3 and he had some good chuckles.

Diversifying*