Pacov's place to enjoy the show.

I've locked/archived this thread/blog and have started a new discussion over here:  http://forums.demigodthegame.com/454943/

Please join me if you like.

 

 

 


 

 

Am I streaming


 

 

Well, I started a thread  back in August (https://forums.joeuser.com/411269/) that's seen a lot of activity and actually had quite a few good bits of information for new and old players alike.  I figure it's time to start a new thread and perhaps keep the OP up-to-date with useful information, etc.  Feel free to use this post for any LoL discussion, etc.

Super fast background:  I played a lot of Demigod as pacov/cheesuscrust.  Back in August 2011 or so, I started getting heavily involved in LoL and folks have been kind enough to chime in with tips and links to various sites that have been quite useful to me.  In addition, I've been able to keep up with folks that I've played Demigod with in the past and meet some new folks that play LoL and frequent these message boards. 

Here's some of the things I've learned in the previous thread:

 New Player tips

  • Play the tutorial.
  • Consider picking up the starter bundle.  It's 530 RP (that's about $4).  You get 8 champs unlocked, a 4 win IP boost and a 10 win XP boost.  It's a pretty good deal (used it recently on an alt account).  You can find it in the game store under bundles.
  • Riot gives you 400 RP as soon as you hit level 5.  It's enough to buy some skins, a boost, or a cheap character. 
  • Learn to last hit!  Last hitting is simply landing the last hit on creeps.  If you last hit, you get gold for that kill.  The number of creeps you have killed is tracked in a value called CS.  You can see this number in the top right hand corner of the ui or by pressing tab.  Here's a really simple tutorial re: last hitting if you are brand new - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LheiRB76x5g
  • Read some guides on any character you want to try out.  The recommended builds (what you see when you go to a shop) are not optimal.  The guides include item suggestions and skill orders.  These are very useful in learning decent ways to build characters
  • Use the rune combiner to get level 3 runes prior to level 20 if you like.  You will need 375 IP.  Buy any tier 1 rune that costs 15 IP.  You need to purchase 25 of these.  Click on your rune page.  In the bottom right hand corner there is a button called the Rune Combiner.  If you place 5 runes in there, you can get a random rune that is 1 tier higher (eg if you have 5 tier 1 runes, you will get 1 random tier 2 rune.  Anyway, the math works out such that you spend 375 IP ( buy 25 tier 1 15 IP runes) and you get 1 completely random tier 3 rune.  Some of the quintessences are 2k IP, so if you luck out and get one of those, you just won the lottery.  You can always keep the random tier 2 rune if you end up with something good and don't want to trade it out yet.
  • Consider setting aside IP for tier 3 runes (available at level 20 and above).  You can't purchase them with real money - only IP.  Keep that in mind.

Great site I visit every day for LoL related news - http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends

pacov's misc info

Here's a guide I made

pacov's Guide to Improving at League of Legends and Moving Up in Elo

k - so I'm just going to put down some of my thoughts.  I'm not amazing at this game, but I do certain things that improve my odds of winning in ranked and so far its panning out just fine (bronze 5 to gold 5 in about a month or so).  We all have varied skill levels, so some of this might be useful and some not.  Caveat complete.

Prerequisite- you need to know how to play every single role.  You don't have to be a god at every single role (more power to you if you are - I'm certainly not).  You need to be able to play at a serviceable level in every single role and excel at least at 1 role (preferably 2).  In my case, I'm good at support and adc.  I'm not great, but have serviceable mids and jungles and so so tops.  Knowing what you are good at and bad at is very important.  If you don't know, I can probably tell you - but you really should know...  Anyway, you need to have enough champs to make solid picks in any role and you need to be able to cover any role if it comes down to it.  I'll talk about how to get better at specific roles in a bit.

Champ select advice - Don't be the "fill" guy unless you really feel like you are awesome in all roles.  Call your preferred role immediately when you hit the lobby.  Say "adc pref."  Do this as soon as you hit the lobby.  Some people believe that if you call a role you magically get it.  This is stupid, but if you call something out, folks will often accomodate your request.  If you are feeling wishy washy for whatever reason, call out multiple roles in order of what you want to play - "adc/mid pref."  In my experience, you generally do not want to call support.  It's a very important role, but you want to be in a position to carry every single game if possible.  If you aren't calling out a role, you are hoping that other players can carry you.  If you are hoping that folks will carry you, you don't deserve to win.  You need to know your best roles and you absolutely should request them.

Solo or duo in ranked? - Well, my 1st thought here is that you should solo.  If you solo, you have to rely on yourself.  IMO - its a much bigger test of skill to play solo and win than to duo.  Do you want someone to carry you or do you really want to know that you are actually good?  That said, provided you have the right duo partner, you can increase your odds of winning quite a bit.  The simple math is that instead of having 4 teammates as unknown quantities, you only have 3.  If you have a good duo teammate, you know what you can expect.  When you duo, you get the most bang for your buck by having complimentary roles.  Support/adc is good; jungle/mid also works.  Even if you don't have direct symmetry in roles, if you are an amazing mid and I'm an amazing adc, our odds go up quite a bit if we both get those roles.  Our odds go way down if we can't get those roles and are forced to play out of positions that we are weaker.  For example, Bryff is a good mid.  If he duo's up with me, the only way he will get to play that role is for me to call mid, take it myself, and then put myself into a position like support where I can't carry out of (I'm always 1st pick, Bryff is always last pick when we duo)... that and I have to show the mid I'm picking at the start which means Bryff gets hard countered.  In short, we can expect that we will be a disadvantage when duo queuing.  Now, if Bryff queued up with someone at a lower elo than himself that was solid, he'd likely be 1st pick and be able to get mid and have a better chance of carrying the game.  Anyway, you need to keep in mind where you end up in pick order when duoing if you aren't looking to go adc/support.  If you want that, you can usually get it. 

How do you get better in roles that you are not good at? - Well, here's what I do.  And this is really what I do on a regular basis.  I think about what I'm good at and what I'm not good at.  For instance, I realized that I don't play any hyper carry ads.  So, I read up on hyper carries like vayne and kog maw.  I look for guides on how to build them (most adcs are the same btw ), I look for vids on how people play them (eg how do I all in with a specific champ - is there a combo - when do I all in - what's the best way for me to burst - how should I behave in lane with this champ).  Then, I fire up a custom game and try out the mechanics of whatever champ vs AI.  Usually I learn a few tricks during that custom on how to position myself, etc.  Then, I'm off to normal games where I'll request the role or character I'm trying out.  Now, people still report your for being awful in normals, but it really is where you need to try out characters to see if you are any good or not as the bots are useless for proving your skill level to yourself.  So, fire up that normal and ask to play a role (again - after you've tried out the champ against bots).  If you don't know anyone you are with and you are quite awful, I suggest muting everyone at the start of the game.  Then, do your best.  Continue with this until you feel like you have a serviceable skill level in whatever role.  And keep in mind what you need to work on.  For me, I noticed I didn't really have alot of mids for ranked, so I started practicing some with gragas against and karth.  That way, I'll be able to get the job done if I need to play mid.  The next thing I need to do is put more time into being better top lane. Again, because while I prefer adc/support, I might need to play top for the team.  So, best to be ready for it.  Put your time in and practice roles. 

One last thought - there are certain things you can generally expect in ranked.  1 - if you are 1st pick, you generally can call whatever you want.  Common knowledge, I'm sure - but I'll add - CALL WHATEVER YOU WANT.  2 - if you duo queue, you generally can lock down both adc and support.  It works best if your adc is 1st pick, ofc.  I've bumped into like 10 random dedicated supports in all of my games of LoL.  People generally aren't going to call support. So, if you are 1st pick and duo'd, just call adc and then your duo partner can almost always get support.

 

Lol King profiles for ranked tracking

I'm not going to update this regularly, so just consider it a snapshot (I'll add a date when I update them).  Anyway, I enjoy seeing folks progress through ranked and keeping tabs on that sort of thing from time to time. 

Snapshot updated 05/28/2014

 Character guides

Mid Ziggs by cow - http://www.lolking.net/guides/7906

Comments (Page 176)
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on Feb 17, 2013

Just so everyone knows-I have 39 champs, and I can get about 6000+ ip in 12 days.  Working to get more.

Second thing-I'm looking to play a lot, mainly top, jungle, and adc.  I feel like I lack on these positions and more practice is good.  Like, when I nidalee top, I always get pushed around, but when someone else went nidalee top, they went 5/0 when their first items were tanky.  However I feel like I also need to get more champions on the jungle and top roles.  So, I guess it'll be a while.  I just want to feel confident if I need to fill those positions ranked.

on Feb 18, 2013

sleepy pacov says... holy crap was that some work.  I've FINALLY hit my promotional series in silver 3.  lots of losses early.  Then played 2 with bryff and 2 with trouser (last game I had to work like a mofo to get a win, but we got it).  Anyway, if I win 2/3 I'll adv.  Good luck to me tomorrow or the next day.  really hope I promote up.

on Feb 18, 2013

Random details from ranked stuff - Bryff is currently the chosen one.  I think he's on like a 5-6 game win streak.  Pretty sure riot wants to make babies with him or something, though.  Both games I duo'd with him yesterday were complete mismatches in our favor.  Bryff's currently in a promo series with 1 win.  1 more win out of the next 2 games and he'll move up to silver 2 at least.

I have another theory re: promotions to leagues (eg when I went from silver 5 to silver 3 (skipping silver 4)) - I wonder if you skip over a league if you promote out of a league while you are still a recruit.  Might be completely unrelated. 

also played some ranked w sharpy yesterday - I think we went like 2/1 or something to that effect. 

Yesterday I started around 60lp... went all the way down to 9lp (jebus)... and then all the way up to 100 lp.  Ready to start my promo series. 

edit - so, I played more than a few ranked games yesterday.  About 5% of those games had a support other than taric on the enemy team.  I don't think I managed to get a taric support on my team ever.  In short, I dislike playing against taric every fucking game...

on Feb 18, 2013

Me and Gotnades finished up duoing to get him placed. We went 8-2 out of his 10 placement matches and he landed in Silver I. I absolutely loved duoing with him because I got first pick every game. I got to ban shen, tf and an assortment between kayle/amumu/blitz depending on what the other team banned. I also played Brand every game out of those 10 pretty much destroyed my lane every game.

on Feb 18, 2013

OMG_ZEX
Me and Gotnades finished up duoing to get him placed. We went 8-2 out of his 10 placement matches and he landed in Silver I.

That's cool.  Do we know who is the highest ranked amongst those of us that play together regularly?

on Feb 18, 2013



That's cool.  Do we know who is the highest ranked amongst those of us that play together regularly?


If you don't count Rawrrr/wallstop Its probably me or Jona but I haven't looked at Jona's placement in a while, I am sure he is gold something.

on Feb 18, 2013

OMG_ZEX
If you don't count Rawrrr/wallstop Its probably me or Jona but I haven't looked at Jona's placement in a while, I am sure he is gold something.

yah, but what specific level are you folks at?  Don't have access to that info at work.  Also, I'm curious who's super into ranked games.  I'm not sure how many of us prefer ranked over normal at this point.  My goal at this point is to hit gold as quickly as possible and then see if I have what it takes to progress further.

Also, I think I read that they are changing ranked so that once you hit a specific level, you can't be demoted past it, but I might be mistaken - anyone else read that?  I think the lowest you can go is the bottom of a particular class.  Eg if you are silver 5, you can't be demoted to bronze - you always stay in silver until you move up, if you do.  same goes for gold - you don't get demoted to silver, you just stay at the bot of gold.  No idea if that's factual or not.

on Feb 18, 2013

I was really into the idea of ranking up, but I'm not sure now that I've realized that your division has nothing to do with who you're matched against.

Just lost a ranked game where my team wasn't horrible... but the only Warmog's on our team was on the ADC so it was a bit frustrating.  I looked at peoples ranked games played after and every opponent was hovering around 150 wins and every guy on our team was below 20.

So... if you're in silver and have gold level super secret MMR, do you have to play gold players to get out of silver?  If you have platinum MMR do you have to play platinum players even if you end up in bronze?

Kinda frustrating system now that I'm learning how it works.

 

on Feb 18, 2013

The guys with less than 20 wins are in the same rank.  Which is the problem with LOL.

 

Silver is a shit place to be.

on Feb 18, 2013

Thundercles
So... if you're in silver and have gold level super secret MMR, do you have to play gold players to get out of silver? If you have platinum MMR do you have to play platinum players even if you end up in bronze?

I looked at several games recently and I've been playing with and against folks at various levels.  I haven't quite figured out a pattern.  I know that just about every game I had in silver 5 I'd be up against folks at least at silver 3.  Don't think I actually played with anyone that was actually in silver 5.  That probably has to do with me being a "recruit" at the time.  It makes sense if I'm up to promote from silver 5 to silver 3 that I should have to fight tougher opponents.  If I was only moving to silver 4, then I'd think it would make more sense to have me fight against 3's and 4's... it might actually work that way.  I think most of my recent games have me fighting against silver 3's and 1's.  At least in my experience, most of my games have been against/with folks at higher levels than me.  So, its probably very much influenced by mmr. 

Side note - I'm sure my mmr was high when I was in bronze.  I did not get matched up against any gold folks during that time - at best, I was fighting against silver 3s.  I believe that I will start to see alot of gold level players when/if I hit silver 1 based on how things are going.  I'll keep an eye on things. 

 

on Feb 18, 2013

I am in gold I, Jona is in Gold II, Orcun is in Gold I, Wallstop is in plat V, Rawrr is in Gold I. I don't think rawrr and wall have played like any ranked games this season though.

on Feb 18, 2013

The guys with less than 20 wins are in the same rank.  Which is the problem with LOL.

are you implying i don't deserve Silver I because i only have 7 wins and others have 150? How do you get to 150 wins without having 20 wins at some point (unless you simply don't have any ranking at all until you have 50 wins). 

So... if you're in silver and have gold level super secret MMR, do you have to play gold players to get out of silver?  If you have platinum MMR do you have to play platinum players even if you end up in bronze?

Kinda frustrating system now that I'm learning how it works.

Short answer: yes. 

Long answer:

Each division has a range of Elo. If you are within that range, you will gain a "normal" amount of LP per win/loss. If you are below that range the system doesn't think you deserve to be there, but is willing to give you the benefit of the doubt.

Wins give you more LP, and you lose less LP when you lose. The exception to this is when you are in the 80-100 range of a Rank I Division. You start getting much smaller LP/win because the system wants to ensure you can earn the higher tier. This was also to prevent people from intentionally tanking their MMR to a really low level, then winning easy games against bronze players to promote. 

If you are above the Elo range, the system thinks that may have had an unlucky string of games. 

Wins give you more LP (because of how promotion series work, there isn't as much of a risk for giving more LP since you have to win the series), and takes away less for a lose.

 

Anyway, the justification for all of this: 

Elo is a "rating" system. Its purpose is to give you a number that you can use to calculate the statistical probability you would win against any other random player. 

However, it is also treated as a "reward" system. People are given titles and prizes for getting certain arbitrary Elo thresholds. It also makes you feel punished for losing a 4v5, or playing with a troll.

 

Separating Elo into an MMR + LP system, means that Riot can continue to use the 'rating' system when it comes to matching players into 'fair' games. 

However, they can tweak LP around significant to lessen the amount of punishment for certain things, or to increase punishment for others. 

For example, they gave the 3 LP dodge penalty because that is a punishment that doesn't affect your rating (unlike prior Elo systems). 

In the future, i expect them doing more LP tweaks for AFKs/Trolls/etc.

For Elo, AFKs/Trolls/etc don't matter because you are less likely to get an AFK/Troll/etc on your team as long as you don't do those actions. Therefore, you will get slightly more "free wins" and your Elo will gradually rise over 100 games. But it /feels terrible losing 20 Elo to a troll/.

Minimizing LP loss in that situation minimizes how much you, the player, feels that the system punishes you, while still allowing Elo to accurately rate you. It also takes power away from trolls/AFKs (if you only lost 5 LP to an AFK/Troll, then someone threatening to troll you wouldn't be much of a threat at all, esp if the troll lost 50 LP).

 

Side note - I'm sure my mmr was high when I was in bronze.  I did not get matched up against any gold folks during that time - at best, I was fighting against silver 3s.  I believe that I will start to see alot of gold level players when/if I hit silver 1 based on how things are going.  I'll keep an eye on things. 

 
your MMR was reset to 1250 at the implementation of the League System. You went 2-8 (?) in your placement. Your MMR was probably around 1100.
 
Elobuff has your current MMR at 1267 - supposedly you can still ask the server for Elo like before. 
 
Also according to Elobuff, Silver III has an average Elo of 1444. 
on Feb 18, 2013

<hit quote instead of edit>

on Feb 18, 2013

Just a note, when pacov was in bronze 1 and I was silver 3 and we duoed, he was placed above me in picks, and I won 6-4 in placements in S2 and preseason, so it's not like my elo was low.

on Feb 18, 2013

Elobuff could be totally wrong. But being reset to 1110 and then being 1267 after going like 23-15 sounds reasonable. 

 

Original MMR could also be taking into account Normal games/wins/Elo. i don't really know.

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