Pacov's place to enjoy the show.

I've locked/archived this thread/blog and have started a new discussion over here:  http://forums.demigodthegame.com/454943/

Please join me if you like.

 

 

 


 

 

Am I streaming


 

 

Well, I started a thread  back in August (https://forums.joeuser.com/411269/) that's seen a lot of activity and actually had quite a few good bits of information for new and old players alike.  I figure it's time to start a new thread and perhaps keep the OP up-to-date with useful information, etc.  Feel free to use this post for any LoL discussion, etc.

Super fast background:  I played a lot of Demigod as pacov/cheesuscrust.  Back in August 2011 or so, I started getting heavily involved in LoL and folks have been kind enough to chime in with tips and links to various sites that have been quite useful to me.  In addition, I've been able to keep up with folks that I've played Demigod with in the past and meet some new folks that play LoL and frequent these message boards. 

Here's some of the things I've learned in the previous thread:

 New Player tips

  • Play the tutorial.
  • Consider picking up the starter bundle.  It's 530 RP (that's about $4).  You get 8 champs unlocked, a 4 win IP boost and a 10 win XP boost.  It's a pretty good deal (used it recently on an alt account).  You can find it in the game store under bundles.
  • Riot gives you 400 RP as soon as you hit level 5.  It's enough to buy some skins, a boost, or a cheap character. 
  • Learn to last hit!  Last hitting is simply landing the last hit on creeps.  If you last hit, you get gold for that kill.  The number of creeps you have killed is tracked in a value called CS.  You can see this number in the top right hand corner of the ui or by pressing tab.  Here's a really simple tutorial re: last hitting if you are brand new - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LheiRB76x5g
  • Read some guides on any character you want to try out.  The recommended builds (what you see when you go to a shop) are not optimal.  The guides include item suggestions and skill orders.  These are very useful in learning decent ways to build characters
  • Use the rune combiner to get level 3 runes prior to level 20 if you like.  You will need 375 IP.  Buy any tier 1 rune that costs 15 IP.  You need to purchase 25 of these.  Click on your rune page.  In the bottom right hand corner there is a button called the Rune Combiner.  If you place 5 runes in there, you can get a random rune that is 1 tier higher (eg if you have 5 tier 1 runes, you will get 1 random tier 2 rune.  Anyway, the math works out such that you spend 375 IP ( buy 25 tier 1 15 IP runes) and you get 1 completely random tier 3 rune.  Some of the quintessences are 2k IP, so if you luck out and get one of those, you just won the lottery.  You can always keep the random tier 2 rune if you end up with something good and don't want to trade it out yet.
  • Consider setting aside IP for tier 3 runes (available at level 20 and above).  You can't purchase them with real money - only IP.  Keep that in mind.

Great site I visit every day for LoL related news - http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends

pacov's misc info

Here's a guide I made

pacov's Guide to Improving at League of Legends and Moving Up in Elo

k - so I'm just going to put down some of my thoughts.  I'm not amazing at this game, but I do certain things that improve my odds of winning in ranked and so far its panning out just fine (bronze 5 to gold 5 in about a month or so).  We all have varied skill levels, so some of this might be useful and some not.  Caveat complete.

Prerequisite- you need to know how to play every single role.  You don't have to be a god at every single role (more power to you if you are - I'm certainly not).  You need to be able to play at a serviceable level in every single role and excel at least at 1 role (preferably 2).  In my case, I'm good at support and adc.  I'm not great, but have serviceable mids and jungles and so so tops.  Knowing what you are good at and bad at is very important.  If you don't know, I can probably tell you - but you really should know...  Anyway, you need to have enough champs to make solid picks in any role and you need to be able to cover any role if it comes down to it.  I'll talk about how to get better at specific roles in a bit.

Champ select advice - Don't be the "fill" guy unless you really feel like you are awesome in all roles.  Call your preferred role immediately when you hit the lobby.  Say "adc pref."  Do this as soon as you hit the lobby.  Some people believe that if you call a role you magically get it.  This is stupid, but if you call something out, folks will often accomodate your request.  If you are feeling wishy washy for whatever reason, call out multiple roles in order of what you want to play - "adc/mid pref."  In my experience, you generally do not want to call support.  It's a very important role, but you want to be in a position to carry every single game if possible.  If you aren't calling out a role, you are hoping that other players can carry you.  If you are hoping that folks will carry you, you don't deserve to win.  You need to know your best roles and you absolutely should request them.

Solo or duo in ranked? - Well, my 1st thought here is that you should solo.  If you solo, you have to rely on yourself.  IMO - its a much bigger test of skill to play solo and win than to duo.  Do you want someone to carry you or do you really want to know that you are actually good?  That said, provided you have the right duo partner, you can increase your odds of winning quite a bit.  The simple math is that instead of having 4 teammates as unknown quantities, you only have 3.  If you have a good duo teammate, you know what you can expect.  When you duo, you get the most bang for your buck by having complimentary roles.  Support/adc is good; jungle/mid also works.  Even if you don't have direct symmetry in roles, if you are an amazing mid and I'm an amazing adc, our odds go up quite a bit if we both get those roles.  Our odds go way down if we can't get those roles and are forced to play out of positions that we are weaker.  For example, Bryff is a good mid.  If he duo's up with me, the only way he will get to play that role is for me to call mid, take it myself, and then put myself into a position like support where I can't carry out of (I'm always 1st pick, Bryff is always last pick when we duo)... that and I have to show the mid I'm picking at the start which means Bryff gets hard countered.  In short, we can expect that we will be a disadvantage when duo queuing.  Now, if Bryff queued up with someone at a lower elo than himself that was solid, he'd likely be 1st pick and be able to get mid and have a better chance of carrying the game.  Anyway, you need to keep in mind where you end up in pick order when duoing if you aren't looking to go adc/support.  If you want that, you can usually get it. 

How do you get better in roles that you are not good at? - Well, here's what I do.  And this is really what I do on a regular basis.  I think about what I'm good at and what I'm not good at.  For instance, I realized that I don't play any hyper carry ads.  So, I read up on hyper carries like vayne and kog maw.  I look for guides on how to build them (most adcs are the same btw ), I look for vids on how people play them (eg how do I all in with a specific champ - is there a combo - when do I all in - what's the best way for me to burst - how should I behave in lane with this champ).  Then, I fire up a custom game and try out the mechanics of whatever champ vs AI.  Usually I learn a few tricks during that custom on how to position myself, etc.  Then, I'm off to normal games where I'll request the role or character I'm trying out.  Now, people still report your for being awful in normals, but it really is where you need to try out characters to see if you are any good or not as the bots are useless for proving your skill level to yourself.  So, fire up that normal and ask to play a role (again - after you've tried out the champ against bots).  If you don't know anyone you are with and you are quite awful, I suggest muting everyone at the start of the game.  Then, do your best.  Continue with this until you feel like you have a serviceable skill level in whatever role.  And keep in mind what you need to work on.  For me, I noticed I didn't really have alot of mids for ranked, so I started practicing some with gragas against and karth.  That way, I'll be able to get the job done if I need to play mid.  The next thing I need to do is put more time into being better top lane. Again, because while I prefer adc/support, I might need to play top for the team.  So, best to be ready for it.  Put your time in and practice roles. 

One last thought - there are certain things you can generally expect in ranked.  1 - if you are 1st pick, you generally can call whatever you want.  Common knowledge, I'm sure - but I'll add - CALL WHATEVER YOU WANT.  2 - if you duo queue, you generally can lock down both adc and support.  It works best if your adc is 1st pick, ofc.  I've bumped into like 10 random dedicated supports in all of my games of LoL.  People generally aren't going to call support. So, if you are 1st pick and duo'd, just call adc and then your duo partner can almost always get support.

 

Lol King profiles for ranked tracking

I'm not going to update this regularly, so just consider it a snapshot (I'll add a date when I update them).  Anyway, I enjoy seeing folks progress through ranked and keeping tabs on that sort of thing from time to time. 

Snapshot updated 05/28/2014

 Character guides

Mid Ziggs by cow - http://www.lolking.net/guides/7906

Comments (Page 329)
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on May 07, 2014

Re: Team Mix-Up

I'm pretty sure Hedgie didn't think you were asking to be your team's mid and was referring to Cow wanting to "get the band back together" so to speak with Not In Cataract Anymore.  I only know for sure because he said he'd be a liability and even being out of practice or out of position, he'd definitely be one of the two best players on GEMS.  One of the three best if you end up picking up Mimira.

 

Re: NinCA

I don't have the schedule or reliable internet for that right now.  Quite possibly in a few months but right now I'd be no good for anything but a sub.  And not even great for that since I have no clue nowadays when the lag gods will smite me down.

 

Re: UTH

Screw you Hunters!  I'd be more grateful to Blizzard if I wasn't pissed that it took them so long.

 

Re: Analyst 

It can be tough to be a "Floor General" because you're part of the team and make mistakes as well, so it can be hard to call out your teammates sometimes.  Or just tough for them to hear, especially if they start wondering to themselves whether their mistakes would have happened had the team leader not called for what they felt was a bad play.

Having someone else bring up the mistakes might make for more constructive breakdowns.

 

on May 07, 2014

someone play blood brothers here?i need send my gift ID to 2 guys or recieve 2 id gifts to get full brago mixed my ID is

S7po1H i´ll feel glad if someone use him ty

 

on May 08, 2014

@pacov:

Yeah sorry, i was talking more about NinCA. Like i said, i probably play at a mid-low Gold atm which would be a liability on a team composed of plats to low diamond. Especially from mid.

While i don't mind subbing for your team (and if you need a sub this Sunday or w.e that's fine), i understand your team is MadCast focused. Plus, you really want to be the driving shot caller. Which is fine. But i know that was a problem for NinCA.

If you want me to post more stuff ad-hoc on either here or the steam chat i can try to do that for you. But i was really offering more dedicated coaching NinCA since, like i said, they are going to be a little bit more skilled games. (probably).

on May 08, 2014

awuffleablehedgie
Plus, you really want to be the driving shot caller

oh - well... not so much anymore - the less responsibility for me the better, but I'm currently stuck in the shotcaller role for my ranked 5's team.  Fairly exhausting dealing with dropping our mid and trying to be kind while he's douching up a storm.  3 hours I spent trying talking to the fellow yesterday... just to put up with more abuse.  Good riddance. 

 

Anyway, when is this ninca stuff starting up? 

 

on May 08, 2014


Anyway, when is this ninca stuff starting up? 
 

I think for it to start up we need some more commitment out of people so if you are interested in playing ranked 5's at a very serious level post your role and rough availability. Currently this is where I am at.

 

Best Role:mid

Can play: Anything at a respectable level.

on May 08, 2014

starting get tired of LOL i have 3 acc in EU 2 from them are gold the other d1 now when i stak to chalanger never get the next step cause they dn´t have slots to more people in chalanger tier fck this really tired

http://www.lolking.net/summoner/euw/25862115

http://www.lolking.net/summoner/euw/35795371

http://www.lolking.net/summoner/euw/29231611

fck riot system in ranked games

on May 09, 2014

oh boy... my relatives came into town on Wed at 1:30AM with 3 kids (1,2 and 3) and they are staying with us... then everyone in town comes to visit... then folks drive in from canton to visit.  My house a zoo for a few more days.  Hence, little to no LoL yesterday anyway.  We'll see if I manage to sneak off for some nerd time at some point.  On the bright side, age of mythology was released on steam last night (which I can actually pause and come back to when I'm interrupted a thousand times).  Fun game imo and worth checking out. 

on May 09, 2014

I would definitely be down for a jungle/top/support role... whatever of those is left open.  IMO jungle karl, bryff top (he's done with school in a few days and I think he could learn other tops easily if he actually wanted to) , dan ADC, me and pacov support... don't know exactly how late karl can stay up either though...  (pacov is usually on earlier, but gets off usually when I get home from work [11pm], sans weekends).  I'd be totally game for it.  I'm not trying to nominate people, but that would seem optimal imo.

on May 10, 2014

Hey yo, Lord of the Ring, I heartily recommend Dawngate, it's currently in open beta, but it has a rather satisfying slew of mechanics that interest people with strong playmaking capabilities and quick reflexes. It has only a basic ranking system, where your MMR places you on a 'leaderboard,' but the developers have shown full interest in adding a true dedicated ranking system.

The game is also extremely generous with character unlocks and loadout pieces being awarded after game conclusions.

I also find the item system to be so incredibly well thought-out that it makes my experiences in other MOBAs pale in comparison.

If you so desire, add one of my accounts and I'll help explain things to the best of my ability:

KrdaxDrkrun (High MMR)

XrekkeGtavun (Low MMR)

 

Because this is a League thread, I now feel bad about posting something completely unrelated...

Soooooo... How 'bout dat Maokai? Still guu'?

on May 11, 2014

mao is still trash like Dawngate - hue.   I gave dawngate a go and didn't really dig it.  That said, def worth checking out to decide if its for you or not. 

 

 

Hedgie - any chance you are free around 7PM tomorrow in case we have a ranked 5's game and need a mid?  Quite a few things up in the air atm as its holiday. I WOULD NOT make plans to be there - just asking if you think you might be around then and I'll update if I get more info.  Thx!

on May 11, 2014

nvm - hedgie - we canceled practice tonight. 

on May 12, 2014

had some fun games in ranked solo queue.  Back in my promo series from crap to slightly less crap.

on May 12, 2014

I can't believe you are actually playing that Udyr build in ranked.

The first game it just killed you.  You were probably going to lose that game, but it went from "small chance of win" to "not a chance in hell" with that Udyr build.  If you had done anything for your lanes, you would have at least had a chance to be in the game later.

The final game the team you were against was openly incompetent. Really really really bad.  Bronze level jungler, and the mid had bronze level mechanics.  But you kept in them in the game for a long time with the build.  I mean, the two key plays that game were your team acing them 4v5 (with no deaths) when you were DC'd, and your team acing them to win 4v5 when you were split pushing.  So the two key plays were 4v5 aces that you weren't involved with at all.  That shows where the teams were at.

I get why you do the Udyr thing - it puts up huge stats if your other 4 players are much better than their other 4 players.  If your 4 can hold even against their 4 plus jungler for the first 15-20 minutes, you get to put up absolutely monster numbers.  But you just can't count on Silver players to do that for you.  The point of ranked isn't to put up monster individual numbers - its to win games.  My advice would be to get a build that wins games with the highest efficiency, not a win-more build that puts up the biggest kill numbers.  Basically, don't do that Udyr thing for the same reason that mids don't build Mejais.

FF Udyr isnt the worst thing ever.  Just don't completely abandon your Silver teammates for the first 15-20 minutes of the game.   You should be able to sacrifice a few stacks to give them a bit of help.

on May 12, 2014

Krazikarl
I can't believe you are actually playing that Udyr build in ranked.

BELIEVE, Justin Bieber. 

Krazikarl
I "DON'T" get why you do the Udyr thing - it puts up huge stats if your other 4 players are much better than their other 4 players.

ftfy.  That's not why I'd play it.  I think any strat that requires the other team to be garbage to work is a bad strategy and I don't think that is the case.  Here's what I think are the pros/cons:

cons

  • low gank potential for 1st 11 minutes of the game
  • lanes must ward for themselves (mostly) and live through ganks if they occur
  • you need at least 1 lane to do well or break even (eg everyone does crap early and this becomes a REALLY bad idea)
  • Any 1 lane giving up a super early tower hurts the play style - possibly crippling it. 
  • low to zero pressure output as jungler 1st 11 minutes.  

pros

  • power farming results in being higher level than anyone in the game in most instances - often 1-3 levels ahead
  • flare completed at 11 minutes resulting in strong counter jungling/dmg increased kill potential on ganks, etc. 
  • incredibly strong split pushing - you can force the enemy team to react to you over and over resulting in additional objectives taken

Here's the way I see it primarily, though - its a setup that requires your folks in lane to not be crap.  1-2 lanes can be crappy, but you need to keep those towers up.  You are trading early game ganks for a higher powered udyr (eg you trade POTENTIAL pressure early for mid/late game) - with the added bonus that their jungler will likely fall way off mid/late due to counter jungling, etc.  Anyway, I think its a perfectly viable strategy which shouldn't be dismissed as something that only works if the enemy team is bad. That said, the strategy fails if folks are bad and give up towers early.  This is true of all junglers - you lose control of your jungle mid/early, you are going to have a bad time on any jungler. 

I think its really incorrect to equate this strategy to that of grabbing a meija on mid... unless your mid gets full stacks at 11 minutes and never loses a stack... 

anyway, recaps and then addressing a few more of your comments.

recap on game 1 - I don't even fugging know.... I did a good job counter jungling the enemy amumu for a bit. Got 3 buffs 1st rotation, our team got 1st tower down easily before the enemy team could and I got the team a dragon then, then store (barely) the enemy red.  That was a bit of a ballsy call and then I made a misplay shortly after that.  The rest was just our team being a bag of monkeys.  None of the team rotations make much sense after that while the enemy team picks off people at random.

my adc lucian game - I kick arse - decent support with me.  Going to play lucian more.

my last udyr game - I execute the strategy fine overall.  Lose my net for about 5-8 minutes and was pleasantly surprised that my team got work done (would have been really bummed if the game was thrown or lost while I was stuck dc'd).  Can't really say much else and I agree - the enemy team was weak. 

 

OK - back to some of your other comments

Krazikarl
If your 4 can hold even against their 4 plus jungler for the first 15-20 minutes, you get to put up absolutely monster numbers. But you just can't count on Silver players to do that for you.

hmm... fairish point.  But really - its silver - can you count on your team consistently to do anything?  I've got just as good odds of getting a team that all does well in lane and doesn't feed as I do of having absolute idiots.  If I somehow only get 1 idiot on my team, am I going to gain a ton by trying to gank for that guy? 

Krazikarl
My advice would be to get a build that wins games with the highest efficiency, not a win-more build that puts up the biggest kill numbers.

That's good advice.  I'm not sure what is the best, most efficient setup on FF udyr and am continuing to tweak.  All thought for me re: udyr is currently built around ff though.  The rest of the build I'm thinking through and up for feedback.  Trick2g tried out getting a razor and spirit stone on first back (11 gold).  That enables additional ganking options and makes it so that you don't really need to back... but its like 700 in sunk gold.  Not really sure I dig it, but it compensates for lack of turtle stance.  I've also been toying around with getting a point in turtle early as well. 

Other item stuff - I typically go wriggles/mercs/sunfire.  I've been toying around with what I usually do on xin - wriggles/mercs/botrk/tank item(s).  Still maxing turtle last - just getting a point here and there earlier.  All a bit in flux.  Power leveling still a priority.  With characters like xin, I'm much more likely to gank, but maintain a similar playstyle.  Xin has really nice built in sustain so its even easier to work the jungle and still be healthy enough to gank with plenty of mana. Wriggles udyr loses a lot of mana clearing his jungle and even more if you are swapping to turtle for more health. 

 

on May 12, 2014

Your times are 5+ minutes slow.  First game you got FF at 19:55, second game around 16 minutes (less sure about timing on second game, but it wasn't close to 11 minutes).

The problem is that your team is left hanging 4v5 for 15-20 minutes consistently unless its a bot game where everything goes perfectly.  If you get counter jungled, its a 17 minute FF (because your build is the one Udyr build that sucks against counter jungling).  If a lane gets collapsed too hard, you get screwed.  If you have to protect towers too much, you get screwed.  Etc.  Basically, you need one very specific game type to happen, and if that one specific game type doesnt happen, your whole team suffers greatly.  This is not good.

I mean, consider your first game.  You start out great.  3 buffs, you get a first tower.  Yet you STILL get out jungled by a silver Amumu because your build came online too slowly.  I'm sure that you are a better player than that Amumu was, but he just was better than you in that game because he was doing something all game despite a slow start, while you basically were useless because your build never came online due to a 20 minute FF.  Seriously, go back and watch that game and ask yourself "who did more for his team".  It was obviously the Amumu despite the fact that you are the better player.

Why are you playing a build where silver Amumus are going to be outjungling you just because your silver teammates play like silver level players?

That said, the strategy fails if folks are bad and give up towers early.  This is true of all junglers - you lose control of your jungle mid/early, you are going to have a bad time on any jungler. 

Yes, but most junglers can prevent or slow down bad things from happening in lanes.  If you afk farm the jungle for 15-20 minutes, you can't.  Thats the difference.

I mean, I watched your games.  In the first 15 minutes of the two games, you had exactly 1 half hearted gank that was never going to work.  Thats 1 lane gank as a jungler in 2 games, and you only did that because you felt bad about giving the top Renekton red buff (which your Jax was thankfully good enough to play around).

But really - its silver - can you count on your team consistently to do anything?

Exactly.  But you count on your team to not lose towers, to protect you in jungle against invades while you farm (you can't really protect yourself well due to build), to not lose lanes too hard, etc so that you can farm up a FF.  You intentionally choose a build in which all this stuff must happen, or you are screwed.  Thats the whole point - I'm suggesting that you play a jungle style that doesn't rely on your team doing very specific things for the first 15-20 minutes of a game.

Your strategy is probably pretty good in Diamond - losing a lane there is more about bad farm and a death or two rather than feeding 5 kills and losing multiple towers.  But you are not in Diamond.

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